Sir John Say (born 1415 in

Podington Podington is a village and civil parish in Bedfordshire, England, United Kingdom. The village is within the electoral ward of Harrold in the Borough of Bedford. Podington lies around northwest of Bedford and is about east of the county borde ...

Bedfordshire Bedfordshire (; abbreviated Beds) is a ceremonial county in the East of England. The county has been administered by three unitary authorities, Borough of Bedford, Central Bedfordshire and Borough of Luton, since Bedfordshire County Council ...

, England, died 12 April 1478) was an

English English usually refers to: * English language * English people English may also refer to: Peoples, culture, and language * ''English'', an adjective for something of, from, or related to England ** English national id ...

courtier, MP and Speaker of the House of Commons.

Life

He was the son of John Say (born before 1445) and his wife Maud. His brother, aster William Say, was

Dean of the Chapel Royal The Dean of the Chapel Royal, in any kingdom, can be the title of an official charged with oversight of that kingdom's chapel royal, the ecclesiastical establishment which is part of the royal household and ministers to it. England In England, ...

, Master of the Hospital of St Anthony, London and Dean of St Paul’s. Sir John owned land at Baas,

Broxbourne Broxbourne is a town and former civil parish, now in the unparished area of Hoddesdon, in the Broxbourne district, in Hertfordshire, England, north of London, with a population of 15,303 at the 2011 Census.Broxbourne Town population 2011 It ...

, Little Berkhamsted and

Sawbridgeworth Sawbridgeworth is a town and civil parish in Hertfordshire, England, close to the border with Essex. It is east of Hertford and north of Epping. It is the northernmost part of the Greater London Built-up Area. History Prior to the Norman ...

, Hertfordshire, and

Lawford Lawford is a large village and civil parish in the Tendring District, Tendring district of northeast Essex, England. It is approximately northeast from the centre of Colchester and west of, and contiguous with, Manningtree. Mistley merges with ...

Essex Essex () is a county in the East of England. One of the home counties, it borders Suffolk and Cambridgeshire to the north, the North Sea to the east, Hertfordshire to the west, Kent across the estuary of the River Thames to the south, and G ...

Sir John Say trained as a lawyer and became a

King's Serjeant A Serjeant-at-Law (SL), commonly known simply as a Serjeant, was a member of an order of barristers at the English and Irish Bar. The position of Serjeant-at-Law (''servientes ad legem''), or Sergeant-Counter, was centuries old; there are w ...

, Coroner of the

Marshalsea The Marshalsea (1373–1842) was a notorious prison in Southwark, just south of the River Thames. Although it housed a variety of prisoners, including men accused of crimes at sea and political figures charged with sedition, it became known, i ...

Yeoman Yeoman is a noun originally referring either to one who owns and cultivates land or to the middle ranks of servants in an English royal or noble household. The term was first documented in mid-14th-century England. The 14th century also witn ...

of the Chamber and Crown, Keeper of

Westminster Palace The Palace of Westminster serves as the meeting place for both the House of Commons of the United Kingdom, House of Commons and the House of Lords, the two houses of the Parliament of the United Kingdom. Informally known as the Houses of Parli ...

, Squire of the Body and

Privy Councillor A privy council is a body that advises the head of state of a state, typically, but not always, in the context of a monarchic government. The word "privy" means "private" or "secret"; thus, a privy council was originally a committee of the mon ...

. In 1447 he entered Parliament as MP for

Cambridge Cambridge ( ) is a university city and the county town in Cambridgeshire, England. It is located on the River Cam approximately north of London. As of the 2021 United Kingdom census, the population of Cambridge was 145,700. Cambridge beca ...

and was then in 1449 elected

Knight of the Shire Knight of the shire ( la, milites comitatus) was the formal title for a member of parliament (MP) representing a county constituency in the British House of Commons, from its origins in the medieval Parliament of England until the Redistributio ...

for

Cambridgeshire Cambridgeshire (abbreviated Cambs.) is a Counties of England, county in the East of England, bordering Lincolnshire to the north, Norfolk to the north-east, Suffolk to the east, Essex and Hertfordshire to the south, and Bedfordshire and North ...

, when he was also elected Speaker of the House of Commons. In June 1449 he was made

Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster The chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster is a ministerial office in the Government of the United Kingdom. The position is the second highest ranking minister in the Cabinet Office, immediately after the Prime Minister, and senior to the Minist ...

and in 1449 was appointed

sheriff of Norfolk and Suffolk This is a list of Sheriffs of Norfolk and Suffolk. The Sheriff (since 1974 called High Sheriff) is the oldest secular office under the Crown and is appointed annually by the Crown. He was originally the principal law enforcement officer in the c ...

. By 1450, he was out of favor and in 1451 the Commons demanded his banishment from the court. However, he was pardoned in 1452. From 1453 to 1478 he represented Hertfordshire in several Parliaments and was chosen to serve as speaker from 1463 to 1465 and again 1467 to 1468. In 1455 (until 1478 in three terms under Henry Bourchier, 1st Viscount Bourchier, 1st Earl of Essex) he held the post of under-

Treasurer of the Exchequer The post of Lord High Treasurer or Lord Treasurer was an English government position and has been a British government position since the Acts of Union of 1707. A holder of the post would be the third-highest-ranked Great Officer of State i ...

and from 1476 that of

Keeper of the Great Wardrobe The King's Wardrobe, together with the Chamber, made up the personal part of medieval English government known as the King's household. Originally the room where the king's clothes, armour, and treasure were stored, the term was expanded to des ...

. He was made

Knight of the Bath The Most Honourable Order of the Bath is a British order of chivalry founded by George I on 18 May 1725. The name derives from the elaborate medieval ceremony for appointing a knight, which involved bathing (as a symbol of purification) as one ...

in 1465. He died on 12 April 1478.

Marriage

He married (1st) about 11 Nov. 1446 (grant of the king) Elizabeth, widow of Sir

Frederick Tilney Sir Frederick Tilney (died 1445) Lord of Ashwellthorpe, Norfolk, and Boston, Lincolnshire, England, was the husband of Elizabeth Cheney, Lady Say and father of Elizabeth Tilney, Countess of Surrey. He is notably the great-grandfather of Anne B ...

of Ashwellthorpe, Norfolk, and daughter of Sir Laurence or Lawrence Cheney (or Cheyne), Esq. (c. 1396 - 1461), of Fen Ditton, Fen Drayton, and Long Stanton, Cambridgeshire, Eaton (in Eaton Socon) and Pavenham, Bedfordshire, Irchester, Northamptonshire, etc., Sheriff of Cambridgeshire and Huntingdonshire, 1429–30, 1435–6, Knight of the Shire for Cambridgeshire, 1431, 1432, 1435, 1442, by Elizabeth, daughter of John Cokayne, of Berwardecote, Brunaldeston, and Hatton, Derbyshire, Chief Baron of the Exchequer, 1401, Justice of the Common Pleas, 1405–29, Chief Steward of the Duchy of Lancaster (Northern parts). His wife, Elizabeth, died 2 September 1473. The couple had issue, including: * Anne Say, who married Sir Henry Wentworth of Nettlestead, ''de jure'' 4th Baron Despenser. * Mary Say * Elizabeth Saye Say married (2nd) before 9 Oct. 1474 Agnes Danvers, widow successively of John Fray, Knt., Chief Baron of Exchequer, and John Wenlock, K.G., Lord Wenlock, Speaker of the House of Commons, Chief Butler of England, Chamberlain of the Duchy of Lancaster, joint Treasurer of Ireland, Lieutenant of Calais, and daughter of John Danvers, Knt., Ipswell and Colthorpe, Oxfordshire.

Death

Sir John and Lady Elizabeth Say are buried together at

, Hertfordshire. Say had contracted the mason Robert Stowell to extend the south aisle of St Augustine's Church and prepare a tomb in June 1476.Louis Salzman, ''Building in England down to 1540'' (Oxford, 1952), pp. 537-8. They were survived by seven of their eight children (three sons and four daughters). Sir John Say was an ancestor of

Jane Seymour Jane Seymour (c. 150824 October 1537) was Queen of England as the third wife of King Henry VIII of England from their marriage on 30 May 1536 until her death the next year. She became queen following the execution of Henry's second wife, Anne ...

, third wife of

King Henry VIII Henry VIII (28 June 149128 January 1547) was King of England from 22 April 1509 until his death in 1547. Henry is best known for his six marriages, and for his efforts to have his first marriage (to Catherine of Aragon) annulled. His disagr ...

. He was succeeded by his son William, who also became an MP and Sheriff for Hertfordshire.

References

* "The Visitation of Suffolk 1561", part 1, made by William Hervey,

Clarenceux King of Arms Clarenceux King of Arms, historically often spelled Clarencieux (both pronounced ), is an officer of arms at the College of Arms in London. Clarenceux is the senior of the two provincial kings of arms and his jurisdiction is that part of Engl ...

, and edited by Joan Corder, FSA (

Harleian Society The Harleian Society is a text publication society and registered charity founded in 1869 for the publication of manuscripts of the heraldic visitations of the counties of England and Wales, and other unpublished manuscripts relating to genealo ...

, London; 1981), p. 166 * "The Magna Charta Sureties, 1215" by Frederick Lewis Weis, et al., 5th edition, Baltimore, Maryland (2002), p. 47 * "Plantagenet Ancestry" by Douglas Richardson, Baltimore, Maryland (2004), pp. 207, 381
Parliament and politics in late medieval England, Volume 2 pp 153–174 By John Smith Roskell
{{DEFAULTSORT:Say, John Year of birth unknown 1478 deaths People from Berkhamsted People from Broxbourne People from Essex Chancellors of the Duchy of Lancaster Speakers of the House of Commons of England English MPs 1447 Members of the Privy Council of England Knights of the Bath English MPs February 1449 English MPs 1453 English MPs 1463 English MPs 1467 Members of the Parliament of England for Hertfordshire English MPs 1465 English MPs 1455 English MPs 1478